Worldviews

Branko Milanovic joins the show to discuss his latest book, The Great Global Transformation: The United States, China, and the Remaking of the World Economic Order (2026). We discuss the emergence of a new elite; similarities between Trump, Putin, and Xi; and “national market liberalism” in a multipolar world. Branko Milanovic is a Research Professor at the CUNY Graduate Center and former lead economist at the World Bank. He is the author of Global Inequality: A New Approach for the Age of Globalization (2016), Capitalism, Alone: The Future of the System That Rules the World (2019), and Visions of Inequality: From the French Revolution to the End of the Cold War (2023), and The Great Global Transformation: The United States, China, and the Remaking of the World Economic Order (2026). Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps 00:00:00 Introduction 00:00:40 The Great Global Transformation 00:05:00 Towards a new convergence theory? 00:08:00 Homoploutia and the new capitalists 00:10:15 Does capitalism create the same elites everywhere? 00:13:30 How does global redistribution of wealth affect domestic politics 00:19:15 Evolving state-elite relations 00:24:30 AI and the new arms race 00:30:30 National market liberalism 00:34:35 The nation-state in a changing world order 00:37:30 Economic spheres of influence 00:40:00 Nationalism as an alternative to globalism? 00:42:40 How can West and East be defined? 00:47:00 Warmongering of European elites 00:49:40 Irresponsibility of small states Show Links: The Great Global Transformation Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mark Leonard, Co-Founder and Director of the European Council on Foreign Relations, joins Worldviews with Peter Slezkine to discuss Europe’s evolving identity, the current state of the transatlantic relationship, prospects for ending the war in Ukraine, and the future of Europe in a changing global order. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps 00:00 - 1:00: Introduction 1:00 – 2:45: Brief biography 2:45 - 8:10: The creation of ECFR 8:10 - 11:15: How is the European project defined? 11:15 - 13:20: How did Brexit change Europe? / What is the role of Russia in Europe? 13:20 - 15:55: What is the nature of the transatlantic relationship? 15:55 – 25:55: Did European integration turn out as hoped? 25:55 - 28:35: Europe’s strategic errors 28:35 - 35:15: Is there a “European identity?” 35:15 – 41:10: How US foreign policy galvanizes Europe 41:10- 46:05: From a project of peace to a project of war 46:05 – 48:00: How does Europe want to end the war in Ukraine? 48:00 - 50:00: Can European unity survive peace in Ukraine? 50:00 - 54:00: How does nationalist populism threaten European unity? 54:00 - 57:30: Will the US resist an increasingly autonomous Europe? 57:30 - 1:01:30: What is the fundamental unit of international politics? 1:01:30 - 1:01:49: Outro Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Fyodor Voitolovsky, director of the Institute of World Economy and International Relations at the Russian Academy of Sciences, returns to the Trialogue to lay out Moscow's vision for ending the war in Ukraine, the security guarantees Russia wants for itself, why a UN Security Council resolution may be the only durable guarantee against renewed conflict, and how the Ukraine war has permanently reshaped Russia's relationships with China, Europe, and the United States. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps 00:02:30 Is Russia Winning or Losing the War? 00:17:00 The Spirit of Anchorage and What a Peace Deal Requires 00:27:30 Has Russia Already Achieved Its War Aims? 00:33:00 Borders, Heavy Weapons, and the Risk of a Frozen Conflict 00:43:00 Why Russia Wants a UN Security Council Guarantee 00:49:00 Russia's Future with China, Europe, and the United States Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Arvind Gupta, co-founder and head of the Digital India Foundation joins the Trialogue to discuss the role of technology in electoral politics, the importance of Y2K in jumpstarting India’s digital capacity, the Indian concept of digital sovereignty, the difference between the Indian, American, Chinese, and European approaches to digital technology, and the significance of India, and Indians, to American Big Tech. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Deck: Arne Westad, Elihu Professor of History and Global Affairs at Yale University, joins the Trialogue to discuss his new book The Coming Storm, why the world today resembles the years before World War I more than the Cold War, what roles the U.S., China, India, and Russia are playing in this dangerous drama, and whether the fires burning from Ukraine to the South China Sea can be kept from merging into a global conflagration. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:03:30 The Pre-WWI Parallel: Who Plays What Role 00:13:00 Taiwan, Korea, South China Sea 00:16:00 The China-India Rivalry 00:33:00 Will Regional Conflicts Stay Regional? 00:46:00 The U.S.-Britain Parallel and American Retrenchment 00:53:00 Who Has the Best Prospects Over 50 Years? Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hossein Kanani Moghaddam, leader of the Green Party of Iran and former senior IRGC commander joins the Trialogue from Tehran to discuss the Strait of Hormuz, the nuclear question, relations with Russia and China, and the prospects for a negotiated settlement with the Trump administration. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Federico Petroni, senior analyst at Limes, Italy's leading geopolitical journal, joins the Trialogue to discuss Europe’s anger over the U.S. attack on Iran, NATO’s fraught future, Italy’s Mediterranean strategy, and its regional rivalries with France and Turkey, Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps: 00:04:01 How the Iran War is Hitting Italy 00:11:16 NATO's Uncertain Future 00:15:30 Why Europe is Risking a Transatlantic Crisis 00:20:22 NATO's Real Purpose: Keeping Europe's Peace 00:22:15 Italy's Defense Priorities 00:24:39 Italy and the American Empire 00:28:44 The Libya Intervention and Its Aftermath 00:33:16 Turkey: Rival, Partner, or Both? 00:38:13 Italy's Mediterranean Strategy 00:47:27 Italy, China, and the Limits of Economic Openness Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Zhao Hai, Director of the International Politics Program in the National Institute for Global Strategy at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, returns to the Trialogue to discuss the impact of the US-Israeli war with Iran, the state of US-China trade relations, the future of international institutions, and the prospects of stabilizing cross-strait relations, among other subjects. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps: 00:01:22 Beijing's View on the U.S. War with Iran 00:06:09 China's Interests in the Middle East 00:13:06 China's Regional Strategy Going Forward 00:20:15 State of U.S.-China Economic Relations 00:41:43 The Taiwan Question 00:51:32 Ukraine Peace Prospects and China's Role 00:55:59 China-Europe Relations and the Atlantic Rift Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mathew Burrows, program lead of the Stimson Center's Strategic Foresight Hub, returns to the podcast for a forward-looking conversation. We discuss global demographic decline, the energy transition, the promises and limits of AI, the future of the transatlantic relationship, and China's role in a multipolar world. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps: 00:02:18 Demographics & the Aging World 00:06:02 AI, Automation, and the Labor Question 00:08:15 Can Population Decline Be Reversed? 00:12:40 Aging, Housing, and Intergenerational Tensions 00:15:38 Energy Transition, Renewables, and Nuclear 00:19:43 AI, Inequality, and the Future of Work 00:25:23 The Human Role in an Automated Economy 00:29:05 The Future of the Transatlantic Relationship 00:33:27 Europe Without the American Umbrella 00:42:01 China and the Multipolar World 00:47:07 Free-Floating Alignments and Global Order 00:50:41 Why Greater Eurasia May Be Best Positioned Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Curt Mills, executive director of The American Conservative magazine, joins the Trialogue to discuss the evolution of anti-interventionist thought on the American right. In this conversation we cover the origins of American empire, the extent of U.S. global commitments, the future of NATO, competition with China, and the strategic direction of U.S. foreign policy in Trump’s second term. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Timestamps: 00:01:37 The Origins of The American Conservative and Anti-Interventionist Conservatism 00:04:30 From Iraq War Dissent to “America First” 00:09:07 American Empire, NATO, and the Case for Retrenchment 00:29:19 Russia, Iran, and the Limits of Threat Inflation 00:38:08 China as a Peer Competitor and Managing Great-Power Competition 00:45:18 Grading Trump’s Second Term: Wars, Trade, and Immigration Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The expiration of New Start on February 5 marks the end of over half a century of bilateral efforts to advance strategic arms control. On February 3, the Stimson Center and the Oppenheimer Project convened leading nuclear experts from the US and Russia to imagine what comes next. The American speakers were Scott Sagan (Stanford University), Rita Guenther (The National Academies), and Matthew Bunn (Harvard Kennedy School). The Russian side was represented by Feodor Voitolovsky (Institute of World Economy and International Relations), Dmitry Stefanovich (Institute of World Economy and International Relations), and Anton Khlopkov (Center for Energy and Security Studies). This episode was recorded as a live online event. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:02:20 Russia’s Position on New START 00:10:50 Extending New START Limits 00:16:26 Technology and Strategic Stability 00:21:09 Track Two Dialogues 00:24:54 NPT Review Conference and Iran 00:28:51 Russia on Iran and North Korea 00:38:40 Verification and Data Exchange After New START 00:45:31 New Russian Nuclear Systems 01:03:29 Future of Arms Control Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Fyodor Lukyanov, Editor-in-Chief of Russia in Global Affairs, returns to the Trialogue at the start of an already-eventful year to take stock of Russian strategy amid dramatic U.S. intervention in Venezuela, crisis in Iran, and negotiations over the future of Ukraine. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:01:23 – Reaction to Trump Corollary to Monroe Doctrine 00:08:25 – The Case of Venezuela 00:16:02 – Possible U.S. Intervention in Iran 00:23:56 – A Year of Trump 2.0 00:28:44 – The Role of Europe 00:32:28 – Russian Objectives in Ukraine 00:49:44 – Balancing US-Russia Relations & Ukraine War Aims 00:55:55 – World Order in 10 Years Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Zhou Bo, a retired senior colonel in the PLA and a senior fellow in the Center for International Security and Strategy at Tsinghua University, returns to the Trialogue to discuss China’s calculations about recent events, including the release of the U.S. National Security Strategy, tense Sino-Japanese relations, the situation in Taiwan, and negotiations to end the war in Ukraine. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:01:53 – First Year of Trump 2.0 00:05:59 – The Role of Tariffs 00:11:36 – Beijing’s Response to U.S. National Security Strategy 00:16:12 – Trump’s Corollary to the Monroe Doctrine 00:19:52 – Current Sino-Japanese Relations 00:29:22 – Strategy on Taiwan 00:33:12 – Ukraine War Negotiations 00:37:49 – China’s Relationship with the EU 00:42:53 – Looking to the AI Future Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mike Kuiken and Josh Hodges, two commissioners on the congressionally appointed US-China Economic and Security Review Commission, join us to discuss the recommendations of the Commission’s 2025 annual report and the state of US-China relations more broadly. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:01:18 What is the US-China Economic and Security Review Commission? 00:04:39 The China Problem 00:14:17 A Challenge to the Democratic World? 00:17:41 The Axis of Autocracy 00:26:33 Biden-Era Framework 00:31:52 Policy Recommendations 00:47:42 Necessary International Partnerships Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Glenn Diesen, professor at the University of South-Eastern Norway and host of the Greater Eurasia Podcast, joins us to discuss the current state of affairs in Europe, including the West’s approach to the war in Ukraine, the future of integration on the continent, and the militarization of Scandinavia. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:01:23 Glenn Diesen’s Background 00:03:14 Interest in Russia 00:10:23 Return to Norway and Analytical Perspective 00:14:22 What is Scandinavia? 00:15:59 From Neutrality to NATO 00:22:47 The U.S. Position 00:27:38 The Future of Europe 00:38:28 Will the EU Survive? 00:43:52 Nord Stream 00:48:44 Competition in the Arctic 00:55:25 An Opening for China in Europe? Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Mathew Burrows, program lead of the Stimson Center’s Strategic Foresight Hub, joins us to discuss his career in the CIA and the National Intelligence Council, where he was the lead author of Global Trends , a non-classified report released every four years as an aid to incoming administrations. We also discuss transformative global events of recent decades, the mechanics of predicting trends, and what policymakers often get wrong in confronting the world. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 00:1:36 Mathew Burrows’ Early Biography 00:5:03 A Job at the CIA 00:14:12 The Collapse of the Communist Bloc 00:16:41 Move to the National Intelligence Council 00:22:20 9/11 and the Intelligence Community 00:27:21 Snowden Saga 00:28:54 Global Trends 00:31:41 China Prescience 00:39:16 Trump Admin. & Death of Global Trends 00:48:09 Enter the Policymakers Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

John Mearsheimer, world-renowned scholar of international relations, joins us to discuss the state of play in the Middle East, East Asia, and Eastern Europe. We also examine the relationship between realism and morality, the nature of the China threat, and the origins of “offshore balancing.” Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Leonard Benardo, Senior Vice President at the Open Society Foundations, joins us to discuss OSF’s emergence and evolution, defining values of open societies, and heterodox thinking for turbulent times. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 01:29 – Lenny Benardo’s Biography 05:20 – Origins of OSF’s Name and Mission 09:23 – The “Wild East” and OSF’s Work in the Former Soviet Union 16:55 – OSF’s Approach to Russia, Post-Soviet States, and Eastern Europe 18:53 – Conceptualizing Human Rights 22:06 – Western Foundations, Domestic Politics, and the Case of Hungary 25:01 – Tensions Between Nationalism and Liberal Universalism 30:14 – Dynamics of EU Expansion 36:36 – “Open Society” as a Concept Today 38:42 – Ideas Versus Action 47:45 – Lessons Learned for Approaching China 50:43 – Future of Transatlantic Relationship 54:28 – The Status of American Empire Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Zhao Long, Deputy Director of the Institute for Global Strategic and Security Studies in Shanghai, returns to the Trialogue to discuss Beijing’s perspective on a slew of recent high-profile summits, in the context of China’s complex relations with Russia, the United States, India, and North Korea. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 01:13 – Beijing’s Take on Alaska Summit 07:38 – China as a Guarantor in Ukraine? 11:54 – SCO Summit & China-India Relations 17:05 – SCO’s Role & Non-Western Banks 23:17 – Russian Energy & Power of Siberia 2 30:11 – Putin, Xi & Kim Meet on Victory Day 36:58 – A Series of Trilateral Relationships Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Samuel Moyn, the Chancellor Kent Professor of Law and History at Yale University, joins us to discuss the philosophical underpinnings of liberalism, its role in international relations, and the possibility of a multipolar liberal order emerging in a period of U.S. decline. Listen and subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to stay updated with the latest episodes! *The Trialogue Podcast is hosted by the Stimson Center and produced by University FM. Time Stamps: 01:15: The Liberal Order in Decline 03:47: Features of Liberalism 08:51: Liberalism in International Relations 11:15: The Intellectuals’ Abandonment of Liberalism 16:58: The Roots of Neoconservatism 20:43: Liberal Internationalists, Human Rights, and Intervention 27:41: Decolonization as a Liberal Project 32:41: A Coming Liberal Multipolar Order? 43:35: The EU’s Position in the Emerging Order Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.