How do we lead with purpose, make better decisions, and navigate an uncertain future? On If/Then , Stanford GSB faculty break down cutting-edge research on leadership, strategy, and more, exploring enduring questions and the forces reshaping business and society today, from AI to geopolitics. Hosted by senior editor Kevin Cool.
Stanford Legal: "The Importance of Critical Thinking and Civil Discourse in Today's Polarized World"
32 min
How do you engage effectively across deep disagreement without shutting down the conversation? This week on If/Then, we’re sharing an episode from our colleagues at Stanford Legal , the podcast from Stanford Law School that looks at the cases, questions, and conflicts shaping public life. In a world where confidence is rewarded and humility can feel like a liability, Stanford Law professor Robert MacCoun argues for something radical: fewer unwavering opinions, more critical reflection, and a better way to disagree. On Stanford Legal , MacCoun joins co-hosts Pam Karlan and Diego Zambrano for a conversation about how “habits of mind” borrowed from science can help citizens, lawyers, and policymakers think more clearly, listen more carefully, and build better public debate around difficult questions that don’t have easy answers. Trained as a social psychologist, MacCoun's work sits at the intersection of law, science, and public policy, with decades of research on decision-making, bias, and the social dynamics that shape how evidence is interpreted. In the episode, he draws on his most recent book, Third Millennium Thinking: Creating Sense in a World of Nonsense , co-authored with Nobel Prize–winning physicist Saul Perlmutter and philosopher John Campbell, to explain why probabilistic thinking, intellectual humility, and what he calls an “opinion diet” are essential tools for modern civic life. Related Content: Robert MacCoun faculty profile Third Millenium Thinking Stanford Legal Podcast Chapters: 00:00:00 Introduction 00:01:23 The course, the book, & what motivated it 00:04:06 Habits of mind for better decision-making 00:06:20 Probabilistic thinking and intellectual humility 00:09:57 An “opinion diet” 00:12:16 Reasonable doubt, community, & collective judgment 00:14:13 Scientific optimism and the problem of cynicism 00:17:31 Why trust in science has eroded 00:20:10 Law, science, & the value of procedure 00:22:50 Steel-manning the other side 00:24:58 Public policy as provisional problem-solving 00:30:07 Deliberative democracy and informed public debate 00:32:03 Conclusion See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
What AI Can’t Do — And Why
28 min
“Humans manage to do so much with surprisingly little,” says Douglas Guilbeault , an assistant professor of organizational behavior at Stanford Graduate School of Business. “Whereas AI, by comparison, is doing relatively little, but with so much power, so much compute, so many resources, and by comparison, relatively fewer constraints.” On a bonus episode of the If/Then podcast, Guilbeault describes the implications of his recent work. Although he readily acknowledges that AI is “increasingly able to do quite a lot,” Guilbeault and his colleagues believe they have identified a key principle that distinguishes human intelligence from machine intelligence — and one which illuminates the limitations of machine thinking. Although some researchers and AI boosters believe both humans and AI learn via optimization, Guilbeault and his colleagues have shown that another process more accurately captures how people distill the seemingly infinite complexity of the world and act based on limited information. “You encounter a lot of noise, a lot of chaos, a lot of randomness,” Guilbeault says. “We somehow figure out how to make meaning and establish strong understandings from within that.” What limitations have you encountered in your work with AI? Share your story with us at ifthenpod@stanford.edu. Related Content: Douglas Guilbeault faculty profile Read "A Simple Threshold Captures the Social Learning of Conventions" here Chapters: 00:00:00 Introduction 00:01:40 Why human learning matters for AI 00:05:03 Satisficing and the limits of optimization 00:06:41 Why LLMs learn differently from humans 00:09:58 The stakes of AI hype 00:13:11 “Humanity has had a good run” 00:15:19 Intuition, insight, & conceptual leaps 00:17:38 Beyond statistics: metaphor, vibes, & reasoning 00:19:39 A simple rule for social learning 00:21:18 Is there a ceiling for AI? 00:23:00 Randomness, disorder, & the path to insight 00:25:00 What an optimization mindset leaves out 00:27:54 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
Our AI Future: From Abundance to Apocalypse
45 min
Chad Jones, a professor of economics at Stanford Graduate School of Business, recently published a paper, “AI and Our Economic Future.” Using more than 100 years of economic data, he modelled several potential AI-infused economic futures we may experience. These include the good (abundance, we never work again), the not-so-bad (business more or less as usual), and the ugly (a superintelligence that turns on us, among other catastrophic options). Cheery stuff, Jones acknowledges, but essential to face. “I think the ability for an AI to do everything on a computer that the best software engineer can do, that seems like it’s either here now or will be here within five years easily,” Jones says. “Hacking the electric grid, hacking the financial system, these kinds of scenarios are things that we definitely have to worry about. The good news is, I think if we get through that, the ability of AI to transform the economy for good, it is really there and present. And, that would be a very great and bright future.” Related Content: Chad Jones faculty profile What’s the Price Tag for Preventing an AI Apocalypse? At What Point Do We Decide AI’s Risks Outweigh Its Promise? Chapters: 00:00:00 Introduction 00:01:32 The difference between now & previous periods of innovation 00:02:29 Two scenarios for AI-driven growth 00:06:18 The case for business-as-usual 00:11:06 Weak links and the limits of automation 00:17:53 What the models are showing about growth 00:19:58 The economics of abundance 00:25:29 The weak-link model’s timing & possible adaptations 00:27:51 Who gains in an AI economy? 00:29:55 Catastrophic risk and the downside of acceleration 00:34:31 The downsides of the weak link model 00:36:38 Meaning, identity, and human value 00:39:55 Leisure in a post-work world 00:41:43 What the next generation may inherit 00:44:07 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
The Art of Friction
23 min
“Friction for us has to do with obstacles,” says Hayagreeva “Huggy” Rao, a professor of organizational behavior at Stanford Graduate School of Business. “Obstacles can disable you. Obstacles can enable you.” Rao compares friction to cholesterol: Some is good, but some is bad. “Good friction actually slows you down, gets you to pause, and most of all, gets you to reflect,” he explains. “But there’s also friction that overwhelms you, exhausts you, confuses you.” On this episode of If/Then, Rao explores how to cultivate the productive kind of friction, reduce the unhelpful kind, and manage your team’s most precious resource. “Great leaders are people who think of themselves as trustees of other people's time,” he says. Do you have any favorite examples of good or bad friction? Share one with us at ifthenpod@stanford.edu. Related Content: Huggy Rao faculty profile The Friction Project How to become a friction fixe r Chapters: 00:00:00 Airport baggage claim, waiting, & good friction 00:03:20 Introduction 00:03:48 What friction means in organizations 00:05:42 Where friction comes from 00:07:52 Scaling through smart subtraction 00:08:24 DropBox’s approach to meetings 00:10:45 The problem with meetings 00:13:53 What good friction looks like 00:16:56 Friction, trust, & institutional legitimacy 00:19:31 Why Huggy Rao started studying friction 00:22:20 Conclusion See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
Unconventional Wisdom
26 min
“I don’t see things like anybody else,” says Jonathan Berk, a professor of finance at Stanford Graduate School of Business. “And so I can see things people don't see.” On this episode, Berk explores recent research that pushes against conventional wisdom, from questioning the utility of the debt-to-GDP ratio to asking whether regulation is actually in the best interests of the consumer. “If you disagree with me… You have to write down a convincing theoretical model and analyze [it].” Berk admits his unique lens doesn’t always make life easy. But on the other hand, “it confers an enormous advantage” — and he believes that organizations which are able to harness the power of unconventional thinking can gain a competitive edge. “It’s allowed me to solve problems that other people couldn't solve,” he says. Has seeing the world differently helped you resolve a conundrum? Tell us more at ifthenpod@stanford.edu. Related Content: Jonathan Berk faculty profile What If We’re Looking at the National Debt All Wrong? Chapters: 00:00:00 The Fosbury Flop, innovation, & unconventional thinking 00:03:18 Introduction 00:04:24 Questioning conventional wisdom 00:04:57 Rethinking the debt-to-GDP ratio 00:08:21 A finance perspective on national debt 00:10:36 Why theory matters before alarm 00:12:38 Regulation, charlatans, & consumer interests 00:16:22 Licensing, certification, & competition 00:19:51 The cost of pushing back 00:21:16 Building organizations that welcome dissent 00:24:59 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
Why Who You Are Affects How You Think
24 min
“When people come to view attitudes and opinions towards, say, political policies or issues as relevant to their identities, they become more extreme in their attitudes,” says Christian Wheeler, the StrataCom Professor of Management and Professor of Marketing at Stanford Graduate School of Business. “I become more positive or negative towards an issue the moment it becomes relevant to who I view myself as being.” Wheeler’s research offers insight into our increasingly polarized politics. However, his work has also yielded ideas for bridging divisions — beginning with how we listen to each other and how we see the people we disagree with. The moment we see someone as an individual rather than a category, we become more likely to find common ground. “Instead of viewing you as a Democrat or a Republican, I can view you as an individual,” Wheeler recommends. “Anything that humanizes you and moves you away from this simple category will help me to view you as an individual and less as just an interchangeable member of a category.” How much do your opinions define who you are? Tell us more at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . Related Content: Christian Wheeler faculty profile In a Polarized World, an Open Mind Can Hurt Your Reputation You May Not Be Who You Think You Are Class Takeaways — How to Build Connection Through Better Listening Chapters: 00:00:02 Tattoos, identity, & personal evolution 00:03:26 Introduction 00:03:59 Why identity matters 00:04:56 Identity relevance & its implications 00:08:03 Why openness to the other side gets punished 00:10:57 Identities vs. opinions 00:13:53 The power of individuation 00:15:53 How to break the cycle of polarization 00:19:41 Organizational applications 00:23:26 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
The Paradox of Masculinity
26 min
“Masculinity is my new frontier,” says Ashley Martin, an associate professor of organizational behavior at Stanford Graduate School of Business. Martin, whose work examines why gender plays such a central role in how we perceive and make sense of others, has been looking at how traits associated with masculinity are simultaneously organizationally rewarded even as they’re personally harmful to men. “We spend a lot of time talking about gender inequality through the lens of women’s disadvantage,” she says. “I think that many of the problems that we’re seeing today… are actually bound up in masculinity.” What impact do you think masculinity and femininity have on our work and our world? Tell us more at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . Related Content: Ashley Martin faculty profile Is that Self-Driving Car a Boy or a Girl? Why Taking Gender Out of the Equation Is So Difficult Chapters: 00:00 How movies shape our ideas about masculinity 04:02 Introduction 05:15 How Ashley Martin got into studying gender 05:58 When gender is removed from hiring 07:10 The “pet rock” study 10:35 The universal use of gender 13:02 Gendering objects 15:12 How masculinity affects men 18:13 The current implications of Martin’s research 20:41 What healthier models of masculinity might look like 23:47 Ashley’s next frontier: masculinity, material culture, and social problems 25:07 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
What We Actually Learn From Experience
25 min
Steven Callander has spent years building a mathematical framework to answer the question of how people learn from experience. “Here in Silicon Valley, the expression that you learn from failure is very widespread and very intuitive. But the question is… what do you learn? How do you optimally learn from that experience?” In this episode, Callander, the Herbert Hoover Professor of Public and Private Management and Professor of Political Economy at Stanford Graduate School of Business, explains the hidden, deceptively simple logic of correlated learning — and it may change how you think about finding the right job, the right market, or the right strategy. “It fascinates me and I can't stop thinking about it,” he says. Has theory made an impact on your life? Tell us more at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . Related Content: Steven Callander faculty profile How to Turn Old Ideas Into Creative Solutions to Modern Problems What We’re Still Learning from Silicon Valley’s Bank Collapse Chapters: 00:00 Ann Miura-Ko on learning and the search for patterns in Venture capital 02:51 Introduction 05:23 What is correlated learning? 06:40 Where does this research apply in the real world? 09:28 Brownian Motion 12:45 Steven Callander’s Framework 15:25 Examples of correlated learning when seeking expert advice 20:53 Applying correlated learning 23:57 Why correlated learning research? 24:51 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
How Dating and Sports Explain the Job Market
25 min
Seemingly unrelated activities — like taking a soccer penalty kick or crafting an online dating profile — involve an embedded economics. “Understanding and applying economic logic can be valuable in pretty much any job or any other endeavor in your life,” says Paul Oyer, a professor of economics at Stanford Graduate School of Business. On this episode, Oyer digs into the shared economic logic of online dating and the labor market, explains why pro athletes and sports fans think like economists, and explores how AI has reduced the beneficial friction that was once a part of job searches. Got a question about the economics of dating, sports, or the job market? Ask us at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . Related Content: Paul Oyer faculty profile Utility Player: Paul Oyer Explains How Economics Can Make Sports More Fun Chapters: 00:00 Strategic decision-making in air traffic control 03:06 Introduction 03:27 Why sports are a useful lens for understanding economics 09:53 Why economics matters far beyond money 10:54 Economics & online 14:36 Applications of game theory 16:54 How AI is reshaping hiring and the labor market 22:25 The labor market challenge economists still have not solved 24:18 Conclusion If/Then, from Stanford GSB, features conversations with faculty that explore how their research deepens our understanding of business and leadership. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
If/Then Returns: Season Three
1 min
When should we leap instead of take the obvious next step? Why do we instinctively see gender everywhere? When do our opinions begin to feel less like ideas and more like our identity? If/Then , from Stanford Graduate School of Business, is back with a new season of sharp, surprising conversations that deepen our understanding of business and leadership. Each episode brings you into the room with a Stanford GSB faculty member as they discuss their research and how it challenges conventional wisdom, sharpens judgment, and reframes the way we approach complex decisions. Join us on Wednesdays for a new season of If/Then. What do you want to hear on If/Then? Email us at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
GSB at 100: "The Moment"
28 min
This week on If/Then we’re sharing an episode of GSB at 100 , a limited audio series created especially for Stanford Graduate School of Business’s Centennial. GSB at 100 presents a scrapbook of memories, ideas, and breakthroughs as Stanford GSB celebrates its first century and looks around the corner to what the next 100 years may hold. On this episode of GSB at 100 , you’ll experience Centennial Day, hear Dean Sarah A. Soule honor the past, celebrate the present, and look to what the future may hold. GSB at 100 depicts a school defined not only by its innovation and impact, but by its people: curious students, devoted faculty, and accomplished staff — a community of thinkers, dreamers, and doers. Learn more about the Stanford GSB Centennial See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
This week on If/Then we’re sharing an episode of GSB at 100 , a limited audio series created especially for Stanford Graduate School of Business’s Centennial. GSB at 100 presents a scrapbook of memories, ideas, and breakthroughs as Stanford GSB celebrates its first century and looks around the corner to what the next 100 years may hold. On this episode of GSB at 100, you’ll step inside the classrooms where teaching sparks transformation. Learn more about the Stanford GSB Centennial See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
This week on [If/Then or View From The Top] we’re sharing an episode of GSB at 100 , a limited audio series created especially for Stanford Graduate School of Business’s Centennial. GSB at 100 presents a scrapbook of memories, ideas, and breakthroughs as Stanford GSB celebrates its first century and looks around the corner to what the next 100 years may hold. On this episode of GSB at 100 , you’ll hear from the dedicated and accomplished staff members who work behind the scenes to make Stanford GSB a community unlike anywhere else in the world. Learn more about the Stanford GSB Centennial See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
What's Your Problem: "Teaching Computers to See"
27 min
This week on If/Then, we’re sharing an episode of What’s Your Problem? , a show from Pushkin Industries where entrepreneurs, engineers, and scientists talk about the future they’re trying to build—and the problems they must solve to get there. Hosted by former Planet Money co-host Jacob Goldstein, each conversation explores the challenges and breakthroughs shaping the next wave of innovation. In this episode, Goldstein speaks with Fei-Fei Li, Stanford computer scientist, former Chief Scientist of AI and Machine Learning at Google, and one of the most influential figures in the field of computer vision. Li reflects on her pioneering work developing ImageNet, the massive dataset that helped spark the modern AI revolution, and the “north star” questions that have guided her research from neuroscience to machine learning. Together, they trace how a single insight about how humans see the world led to a paradigm shift in artificial intelligence—and how Li’s vision continues to shape the way we teach machines to see, learn, and collaborate with us. More Resources: • Fei Fei Li • Stanford Institute for Human-Centered Artificial Intelligence (HAI) • ImageNet • What’s Your Problem? If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Chapters: (00:00:00) Introducing “What’s Your Problem?” Kevin Cool introduces the Pushkin Industries podcast hosted by Jacob Goldstein. 00:00:45 — What Is Computer Vision? Jacob Goldstein and Fei-Fei Li explain how machines learn to see and interpret images. 00:03:18 — Real-World Uses of AI Vision Li shares examples from healthcare, robotics, and environmental science. 00:05:06 — Discovering the Science of Seeing How human vision research inspired Li’s lifelong “north star” in AI. 00:09:56 — Creating ImageNet Li builds a massive image database that transforms computer vision research. 00:13:29 — Defining 30,000 Visual Concepts How cognitive science helped shape ImageNet’s massive scale. 00:16:41 — Building the Dataset by Hand Li's team uses global crowdsourcing to label millions of images. 00:19:38 — The 2012 Breakthrough Jeff Hinton’s neural network shatters records and sparks the deep learning era. 00:22:19 — Data Meets Hardware Li reflects on how big data and GPUs converged to power modern AI. 00:24:55 — Lightning Round with Fei-Fei Li Quick insights on resilience, mentorship, and the future of human-AI collaboration. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
This week on If/Then , we’re sharing an episode of GSB at 100 , a limited audio series created especially for Stanford Graduate School of Business’s Centennial. GSB at 100 presents a scrapbook of memories, ideas, and breakthroughs, as the GSB celebrates its first century and looks around the corner to what the next hundred years may hold. The first episode of the series begins where the GSB begins: in 1925, Herbert Hoover, a Stanford alum and future U.S. president, had an idea. “A graduate School of Business Administration is urgently needed upon the Pacific Coast,” he wrote. One hundred years later, what has Stanford Graduate School of Business accomplished, and what might its future hold? Listen in as professors reflect on founding principles, frontier technologies, and the magic that makes the GSB the place it is — and shapes what it aspires to be. If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Each episode features an interview with a Stanford GSB faculty member. Learn more about the Stanford GSB Centennial See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
View From The Top: “Lisa Su Is Still Curious About How Things Work”
56 min
This week on If/Then , we’re sharing an episode of View From The Top: The Podcast , an audio series featuring leaders from around the world in conversation with MBA students. Recorded live at the CEMEX Auditorium at Stanford Graduate School of Business, episodes feature insights on effective leadership, the values that guide it, and lessons learned along the way. Lisa Su, the chair and CEO of Advanced Micro Devices (AMD), leads one of the world’s most influential technology companies, a pioneer in high-performance computing and designer of chips that power everything from cellphones to supercomputers. Su joins Michael Liu, MBA ’25, to talk about what it takes to stay on the cutting edge of technology, the tremendous potential of artificial intelligence, and why her superpower may be her commitment to learning. “Careers are very much by chance,” Su says. “The nice thing about my early career is I was lucky enough to have bosses who asked me all the time, ‘What do you want to be when you grow up?’ And I was like, ‘I don't know. Let me think about [it]...what I like to believe is the ability to learn at each step was what really helped me in my career.” This conversation was recorded on February 24, 2025. More Resources: • Lisa Su • GSB Insights • View From The Top If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Chapters: (00:00:00) Introduction Kevin Cool introduces a summer spotlight on other podcasts, featuring View from the Top. (00:00:59) Meet Lisa Su Michael Liu introduces Lisa Su, AMD CEO, and highlights her career transformation. (00:04:13) Growing Up & MIT Years Lisa reflects on her immigrant upbringing and her journey through three degrees at MIT. (00:05:43) Discovering Semiconductors A part-time lab job at MIT ignites Lisa’s passion for chip technology. (00:07:21) From Engineer to Leader Lisa describes her transition from technical work to managing people and projects. (00:11:19) Tackling Hard Problems How curiosity and teamwork help Lisa embrace high-stakes technical challenges. (00:13:40) Betting on Talent Lisa recounts moments when she was given a chance—and how she now pays that forward. (00:17:03) Becoming CEO at AMD What brought Lisa to AMD and the unexpected call to lead the company. (00:21:51) Strategy in a Turnaround How AMD focused on high-performance computing and long-term bets. (00:25:41) Cultural Shift at AMD Lisa outlines how AMD’s culture became collaborative, ambitious, and learning-driven. (00:27:19) AI & Global Tech Politics The complex intersection of AI innovation and geopolitical regulation. (00:32:37) Open vs. Closed AI Platforms AMD’s open-source AI approach with NVIDIA’s more vertical model. (00:38:54) Future Vision & Final Reflections Lisa offers advice to MBAs and shares what she wants her legacy at AMD to be. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
The Joy of Discovery and Why Research Matters
16 min
As we celebrate the conclusion of the second season of the If/Then podcast, we present a bonus episode featuring Deborah H. Gruenfeld , the Joseph McDonald Professor and Professor of Organizational Behavior and a Senior Associate Dean for Academic Affairs at Stanford Graduate School of Business . Gruenfeld, who appeared on the first season of If/Then in an award-winning episode about hierarchies and the nature of power, returned to the studio to share her thoughts on the value of academic research and its impact on individuals and organizations. “The nice thing about research is that it provides tools and methods and an approach to learn about what’s true in the world, taking into account that what we learn from firsthand experience is not reliable,” she says. “Research helps us build a body of knowledge about what's actually true that we can trust.” This episode was recorded on July 16, 2025. Related Content: Deborah H. Gruenfeld, faculty profile Why Research Matters Why I Research: Findings Fueled by the Head and the Heart If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Each episode features an interview with a Stanford GSB faculty member. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
The Future of Everything: "The Future of Motivation"
34 min
This week on If/Then , we’re sharing an episode of The Future of Everything , a podcast hosted by Stanford School of Engineering professor and friend of the show Russ Altman. Everyone has goals — some are monumental, others modest — but every goal matters. Szu-chi Huang, an associate professor of marketing at Stanford Graduate School of Business, is an expert on sustaining enthusiasm for individuals, customers, and employees across global corporations and organizations. On this episode, Huang shares what it takes to stay motivated over time — not just at the beginning of a goal, when energy runs high, or at the end, when the finish line is in sight, but through the toughest part: the middle. She explains why motivation is a dynamic process that requires different tools at different stages, and offers practical advice drawn from her research on everything from retirement savings and loyalty programs to children’s health and social apps. Along the way, she and Altman explore how purpose, progress, and even a little social pressure can help us keep going — and how AI might someday coach us through. More Resources: Szu-chi Huang, faculty profile & If/Then episode Russ Altman, faculty profile The Future of Everything If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Chapters: (00:00:00) Introduction Russ Altman introduces Szu-Chi Huang, professor of marketing at Stanford GSB. (00:03:31) Studying Motivation Szu-chi shares what led her to study motivational science (00:04:03) Defining Motivation Motivation as the drive to close the gap between current and ideal self. (00:04:57) The Science of Motivation Studying motivation through behavioral and neurological data. (00:05:48) Why It Matters in Business How motivation science applies to leaders, teams, and customers. (00:06:39) Motivation Framework The strategies needed in order to stay motivated over time. (00:07:42) The Mindset of Motivation The different mindsets needed throughout the stages of motivation. (00:09:21) Motivating Kids to Choose Healthy A Collaboration with UNICEF to study what motivates children. (00:10:55) Gamified Coupons in Panama A study using gamified coupons to influence children's food choices. (00:14:26) Loyalty Programs as Motivation How customer reward programs act as structured goal journeys. (00:16:47) Progress Versus Purpose The different incentives needed in each stage of loyalty programs. (00:18:29) Retirement Saving Lessons How financial institutions apply motivational science to long-term goals. (00:21:12) Motivation in Social Context The role of social connections in goal pursuit and sustaining motivation. (00:26:10) Designing Apps for Motivation How redesigning user interfaces can help users stay motivated. (00:27:20) AI as a Motivation Coach Using AI to personalize feedback across all stages of goal pursuit. (00:30:09) Starting and Sustaining a Goal Practical strategies for launching and sustaining a goal. (00:31:57) Conclusion See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
Think Fast, Talk Smart: "Ambiguity to Action: Tensions and Trade-Offs of Leadership and Communication"
23 min
This week on If/Then , we’re sharing an episode of Think Fast, Talk Smart , a podcast hosted by Stanford Graduate School of Business lecturer and friend of the show, Matt Abrahams. How do you communicate with others when you’re confused yourself? For fellow GSB lecturer Rob Siegel, leadership isn’t about avoiding uncertainty: it’s about embracing the clarity that ambiguity can bring. In his latest book, “ The Systems Leader: Mastering the Cross Pressures That Make or Break Today's Companies ,” Siegel explores how leaders today are “living in dualities,” caught between managing existing processes and adapting to emerging disruptions. “The sooner we get comfortable with [change] in the sense of ‘I don't have to like it, but I can deal with it,’ then [we can] lead our teams and give them the calm to know they can get through this.” On this episode of Think Fast, Talk Smart, Siegel and Abrahams explore how to communicate effectively amid constant change. From preparation strategies for spontaneous speaking to building trust through candid conversations, you'll hear practical tips for communicating with clarity when nothing is certain but change. More Resources: Rob Siegel, faculty profile Matt Abrahams, faculty profile Think Fast Talk Smart If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. For a full transcript of this episode, visit our podcast’s website. Chapters: (00:00:00) Introduction Kevin Cool previews season three and introduces a featured episode from Think Fast Talk Smart . (00:00:40) Introduction to Rob Siegel Matt Abrahams welcomes Rob Siegel and introduces his new book The Systems Leader . (00:01:34) Teaching in a Time of Chaos Rob explains how his course on systems leadership evolved amid global uncertainty and AI disruption. (00:02:39) Frameworks for Modern Leadership Rob outlines key leadership frameworks, including five cross pressures from his book. (00:04:01) Communication’s Role in Leadership They discuss how facts, context, and communication help leaders navigate uncertainty. (00:06:18) Balancing Innovation and Execution The conversation turns to managing the tension between creative innovation and operational goals. (00:08:00) Leading Through Ambiguity They explore how leaders can embrace ambiguity as a normal, strategic part of leadership. (00:09:41) Navigating Short- vs Long-Term Thinking Rob breaks down how leaders balance quarterly goals with long-term planning and vision. (00:12:32) Strength and Empathy in Leadership Matt and Rob examine how leaders can balance warmth and strength in team relationships. (00:16:03) How to Keep Students Engaged Rob shares his best practices for engaging students through preparation, spontaneity, and challenge. (00:18:55) Building Trust Through Genuine Care They reflect on the role of genuine interest in others as a foundation for trust and communication. (00:21:35) Communication Role Models and Recipes Rob names Irv Beck as a communicator he admires and shares his top three ingredients for great communication. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
Culture Still Eats Strategy For Breakfast
29 min
Do you stick to the rules or do you roll through stop signs? Whether you’re “tight” or “loose” — how closely you adhere to social norms — has major implications for your life at home and at work. “To be effective, we want to be ambidextrous,” says Michele Gelfand , the John H. Scully Professor in Cross-Cultural Management and Professor of Organizational Behavior at Stanford Graduate School of Business. “Even if we might lean tight or loose, we want to be able to create a context where we can have both tight and loose elements.” Sophisticated strategies will fail if they don’t account for deeply embedded norms, and Gelfand breaks down why the adage that “culture eats strategy for breakfast” is more than just a management cliché. “From the moment we wake up to the moment we go to sleep, [culture is] affecting everything from our politics to our parenting,” Gelfand says. “But we take it for granted — we don’t even think about it. So it’s kind of invisible. And that’s a pretty profound puzzle.” What’s the biggest cultural adjustment you’ve made? Share your story at ifthenpod@stanford.edu . This episode was recorded on January 28, 2025. Related Content: Faculty profile Psst — Wanna Know Why Gossip Has Evolved in Every Human Society? Class Takeaways — The Art of Negotiation Why the Pandemic Slammed “Loose” Countries Like the U.S. If/Then is a podcast from Stanford Graduate School of Business that examines research findings that can help us navigate the complex issues we face in business, leadership, and society. Each episode features an interview with a Stanford GSB faculty member. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .
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