Friends in Formation

On the season finale of Friends in Formation, Tiana and James get input from Becky Willard Heatley (daughter of Dallas Willard) on what Dallas’ relationship with God was like. James and Tiana also answer listener questions on how to read beyond favorite parts of the Bible and how power dynamics play into disciplines and spiritual formation.

James and Richella take on three listener questions with the help of priest and Renovaré Ministry Team member, Tiffany Clark. Together they explore how to walk alongside friends who are struggling with deep theological questions, how to welcome different types of people at church, and how to avoid letting freedom turn into lawlessness.

This week on Friends in Formation, James and Tiana answer questions about staying connected to God in seasons of intense pain and tips for church start-ups. They’re joined by professor and Willard scholar Keith Matthews to answer the third question about how to understand Dallas Willard’s main ideas.

James and Richella discuss listener questions on which books to dive into when you’re just beginning the journey of formation and how to develop deeper trust and vulnerability in community, and guest contributor Brandon Rickabaugh helps answer the final question about the role of obedience in the process of formation.

James and Tiana take on listener questions about how to practice sabbath and how to explore the Streams of Christian tradition as a church, and guest contributor Ted Harro joins the cast for an important third question “What do you think that God is doing in the Church in America today?” Show Notes How do you each do sabbath? How would you facilitate exploration of the Streams churchwide? What resources do you know of that could help us immerse ourselves in the Streams? What do you think that God is doing in the Church in America today? Mentioned Streams of Living Water by Richard Foster Liturgy of the Ordinary by Tish Harrison Warren Recommended Tiana Spencer's recommendation: Living From the Heart Jesus Gave Me by Dr. Jim Wilder James Catford's recommendation: Podcast: Philosophy For Our Time https://art19.com/shows/philosophy-for-our-times

This week on the Friends in Formation podcast, James and Richella discuss praying for your political enemies, surviving (and thriving) in parenthood, and how to encourage experimentation with practices from other Christian traditions.

This week on Friends in Formation , James and Tiana cover three listener questions on "traditional" church, minority voices in spiritual formation, and battling interior resistance to God.

Host James Catford, co-host Richella Parham, and guest contributor Grace Pouch discuss listener questions on discerning God’s voice, the temptation to judge others, and best practices for shepherding children’s spiritual formation.

Kicking off the relaunch of Friends In Formation, James, Richella—and new host Tiana Spencer—discuss three listener questions: how to stop measuring your spiritual life by the world's standards, why genuine adult friendship feels so rare (and how to find it), and how to break free from the overwhelm of too many books and courses.

The final episode of this season of Friends in Formation covers listener questions on why spiritual formation "clicks" at certain ages, whether we should pray the prayer "Disturb me, Lord" (Sir Frances Drake), and knowing when to take a break from something.

Want to Sug­gest a Question? To sub­mit a ques­tion for James, Richel­la, and Nate to con­sid­er dis­cussing on Friends in For­ma­tion , email friends@​renovare.​org . Listener questions guide our hosts into a fruitful discussion about moving from theory to practice in the discipline of Sabbath, exploring historic Christian writers both inside and outside of your own tradition, and learning to pray for others. Three listener questions— I've become a John Mark Comer fan, thanks to your recommendation of his book, The Ruthless Elimination Hurry , on one of your earliest podcasts over the past year or two. That book and some other resources of his have piqued my interest in practicing Sabbath. Could each of you share what your Sabbath looks like—the practical aspects of it. When? How long? What do you do? I want to take this from an idea to a habit and would love to hear how y'all do this. I love the podcast. It always inspires me to draw closer to Jesus. Thanks. I’ve been a Protestant Christian many years. I'm definitely not averse to spiritual wisdom from believers in other traditions. I've had a spiritual director for about six years, and she always points me to resources by Roman Catholics. It kind of bothers me that it seems that there is relatively little by Protestants on deep spiritual formation. Is it just my lack of knowledge or are Protestants much less likely to explore these sorts of issues? I feel almost guilty to be reading all these things outside of my tradition. Do Protestants not care about the issues that Roman Catholic writers address? Hi friends. How do you pray for one? I hear people talk about the power of prayer, and I'm interested in going deeper in prayer, but I've wondered how specific I should be in my prayer request, and how do I know whether I should trust someone with my prayer request? Resources: The Ruthless Elimination Hurry , by John Mark Comer Deeper Experiences of Famous Christians , by James G Lawson A Serious Call to a Devout and Holy Life , by William Law - 158pp Hearing God , by Dallas Willard Spiritual Classics , Richard Foster and Emilie Griffin Devotional Classics , Richard Foster and James Bryan Smith Other writers recommended on this episode: Martin Luther John Wesley Corrie ten Boom Catherine Marshall Frank Laubach Thomas Kelly John Ortberg James Brian Smith Nathan Foster Richella Parham James Catford John Bunyan Louisa May Alcott

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . Show Notes In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, Richella, Nate, and James answer listener questions about Dallas Willard’s version of The Lord’s Prayer, what things get the goat of our hosts, and how to measure progress in one’s spiritual formation. Three listener questions— Question 1: I've been working on praying without ceasing using Dallas' version of The Lord's Prayer. I like his modern translation very much. But when I got to the part that reads "please don't put us through trials" it made me pause. Because the Bible says that ordinary trials, while difficult, build endurance, strengthen us, help us to build character and to grow in faith. Ordinary trials are part of Dallas' golden triangle of spiritual formation. So why do you think Dallas chose the word "trials" instead of "temptations" in his version of the prayer? Question 2: You all sound peaceful, reflective, open, yet humble on Friends in Formation! But could you share what repeatedly 'gets your goat' or trips you up? How do you turn to the Lord each time, how do you think you're being formed through those moments and do you (or should you) see any 'end' to that particular niggle. Question 3: Is it possible to ‘measure’ or ‘assess’ progress in Christian formation either in oneself or in others (if we have some pastoral oversight of them)? Resources The Divine Conspiracy , by Dallas Willard Mirror for the Soul: A Christian Guide to the Enneagram , by Alice Fryling The Spiritual Formation Workbook , by James Bryan Smith and Lynda Graybeal Streams of Living Water , by Richard Foster Renewing the Christian Mind , by Dallas Willard and Gary Black, Jr. Renovaré Institute

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . Show Notes Three Listener Questions— [2:35] My question concerns a phrase I hear you use often in Renovaré — referring to people as “Image Bearers.” I must admit this always makes me sit up as it was not a phrase I had encountered much. At first I wondered if it was just a poetic way of referring to humanity, but am coming to realize it is an important truth and attitude but one I feel I have lacked - I think because my evangelical background had focused more on the 'depravity of Man' and begins viewing humanity (especially oneself) from a position of sinfulness, where the Image of God is lost and only restored in Christ. Specifically, HOW you have learnt to see yourself and others as Image Bearers, not just as a theological belief but in practice, and how doing this helps your spiritual formation. [17:46] I am currently reading The Ruthless Elimination of Hurry (and trying, reasonably, to take my time with it), and next on the list is Streams of Living Water . Some dear church friends have begun to visit the churches of other friends — ones they know have a true, deep relationship with God — who attend churches of different denominations, in order to gain a better appreciation and understanding of their traditions. I find myself wishing that we, too, had many friends of other denominations who could not only serve as our safeguards, but with whom we could afterward discuss their traditions and church’s values, and process those of our own more objectively and reflectively. We would greatly appreciate any suggestions you could offer as to how to go about this. [31:33] From two different listeners in ministry positions: What do you do when you feel like you are in a setting that God hasn’t called you to? I’m a new, young clergy, I graduated seminary last year and feel like I’ve been placed (or have fallen into) a ministry appointment doing work that I’m not called to do but am doing because I have the skills to do this work. What can I do to not just survive during this difficult season but thrive? And have hope that God did indeed call me into a life of ministry and I’m here in this space for a reason? After serving several different churches as a pastor for about 9 years, I am almost 1 year removed from professional pastoral ministry. I chose to stop working as a pastor because the added strain of COVID left me burnt out, depressed, and codependent. I am very grateful to say that I am in a much better place now than I have been for quite some time. I am healthier physically, mentally, and emotionally. God has provided for my family financially. My family and I are connected to a wonderful church. I can definitely tell, even now, that God has brought me to this place as a blessing to provide me with the healing I desperately needed. At the same time, I am struggling with being “set aside” from ministry. I had a very clear calling experience a couple years before my pastoral ministry started. Being a pastor is the only real full-time job that I’ve had before now. I am currently working at a factory, and while it is a blessing in many ways, I find myself constantly looking to what might be next. Do you have any advice on how to better live into and accept where God has me right now? I have no doubt that I am where God wants me to be, but I still find myself constantly thinking about and planning for any and every possible “next thing.” Resources The Ruthless Elimination of Hurry: How to Stay Emotionally Healthy and Spiritually Alive in the Chaos of the Modern World , by John Mark Comer Streams of Living Water , by Richard Foster Clinging: The Experience of Prayer , by Emilie Griffin

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, James, Nate, and Richella answer listener questions about the passing of Queen Elizabeth II, unfairness and injustice in the church, and prayer labyrinths. Show Notes [1:20] I want us to reflect together on the death of Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth, because this is a big world event. We have a lot of folks who have indicated that they’re interested in what all this means, how things fit together in the faith of a very public person. [15:13] How do we respond to unfairness and injustice in the Christian context? [31:16] A church near me has just built a new prayer labyrinth in their side garden, and I have the desire to visit it. I have prayed and meditated using a labyrinth in the past, but I have always struggled keeping my mind on the Lord. What are some suggestions for how I can focus in, slow down, and use the labyrinth to connect deeply with God? Resources Try Softer , by Aundi Kolber

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . ... In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, Richella, James, and Nate answer listener questions about wrestling with unhealthy views of God, habits that can help us read deeply, and whether to pray for someone's healing right away, or only after feeling led to do so. Show Notes [1:10] A.W Tozer opens his Knowledge of the Holy with, “What comes into our minds when we think about God is the most important thing about us.” Dallas Willard wrote that if our view of God does not allow us to wholly give ourselves to God in love, you need to rethink your theology until it does. Question: what significant view of God have you wrestled with successfully? [14:59] Have you experienced integration over the years in your written conversations: in devotional reading, in journaling... and in the two intertwined? [28:02] Should you wait until you feel led to pray for someone's healing, or should you jump right in and just do it? Resources Atomic Habits , by James Clear Abandonment to Divine Providence , Jean-Pierre de Caussade The Knowledge of the Holy: The Attributes of God , A. W. Tozer For more on "view of God," see also: Discovering our Spiritual Identity: Practices for God's Beloved , by Trevor Hudson The Good and Beautiful God , by James Bryan Smith

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, Nate, Richella, and James answer listener questions about which Christian Stream “gives the most bang for the buck,” how to discern when to fast (or practice any spiritual discipline), and how to have spiritual conversations with kids who are grown. [2:32] Of the Six Streams, which is the best one to sit in that gives the most bang for the buck in the journey of Christian spiritual formation? [19:24] I struggle a lot in my day-to-day life with decision fatigue, second-guessing myself, and fears about not being "good enough." This past school term, I developed a very beneficial rhythm of weekly fasting and found the practice deeply helpful. However, now that I'm on my summer schedule that old rhythm no longer works well and I haven't fasted consistently. Whenever it's been a while since I've fasted, I start thinking about it frequently, even every day or every meal and fretting about whether it's a good time or not…. Are there some stabilizing questions or thoughts that I can come back to when I start to debate fasting? What are valid vs. invalid reasons not to fast, be it in the moment or for a season? [37:50] What are some suggestions in talking to adult children about spiritual matters? Resources Mentioned Richard Foster, Streams of Living Water Series on the Cycle of Grace from Upper Room Ministries Trevor Hudson and Jerry Haas, The Cycle of Grace: Living in Sacred Balance

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . --- In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, Nate, Richella, and James answer listener questions about training in joy, how to be a "friend in formation" to a spouse with dementia, and knowing when to confront someone's sin. [1:13] I’ve been a (hopefully) honest apprentice of Jesus for over 50 years, but I've always struggled with a lack of joy in my life. I recently came to the thought that perhaps experiencing joy is something that needs training, much like learning how to live in the constant flow of grace. If this is true, what spiritual disciplines might be best to allow a person to enter into a greater experience of joy. Thank you again for your willingness to share your tremendous expertise in Kingdom living in this setting. I feel as though I'm getting to know the three of you in an interesting, very pleasant way. I look forward to actually meeting you in about 50 years. [15:22] Three years ago, the love of my life came down with dementia. Her dementia has progressed to the point where she's unable to communicate verbally. And a little while ago, her safety and my own health, led me to place her in a home. I visit her on a regular basis and want her to know that she's not only loved by me and our family, but that our heavenly Father loves her as well. I know there is a communication of the heart. So I try to sing to her simple love songs, like “You are My Sunshine,” as well as hymns that she grew up with, as well as holding her hands while I pray for her. I want her to know the peace that will sustain her as we journey together through this horrible disease. Do you have any suggestions? How can I be a “friend in formation” to her? [25:49] It sounds like you hold to a reticence in confronting, except when absolutely necessary. Can you flesh that out a bit, in light of Galatians 6:1, Matthew 18:15-17, and other passages that seem to instruct us that part of love is to kindly address others. How do we discern when it is necessary, good and loving to address someone else's sin? Resources Dallas Willard, Life without Lack Richard Foster, Celebration of Discipline

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . ---- [1:26] In the stage of life me and my husband are in—we have three young children, jobs, and we are involved in our local church, there are lots of opportunities to do good things. When I sit down and look at our family calendar, I feel overwhelmed and unable to do all that I set out to do! How do I know what to say "no" to, and how do I say "no" without feeling guilty? [16:20] When moving forward to understand some of the deep riches of other Christian traditions that have not been familiar to me I sometimes find myself looking back at my own stream of origin and being pretty grumpy. Does anyone else find this happens to them? Any tips on not falling, ironically, into judgementalism about our ‘family of origin’ in our faith? [26:20] Does Christianity have a "body" problem? What is the body and what is its connection to our spirituality as it relates to formation? Resources Richard Foster, Streams of Living Water Dallas Willard, Renovation of the Heart (chapter 9) Richella Parham, Mythical Me

Want to Suggest a Question? To submit a question for James, Richella, and Nate to consider discussing on Friends in Formation , email friends@renovare.org . --- In this month’s episode of Friends in Formation, Richella, James, and Nate answer listener questions about the easy yoke Jesus talked about, experiencing true freedom, and spiritual formation in marriage. Show Notes [1:20] Is it possible to practice the spiritual disciplines out of a place of peace and rest from day one following Jesus, or is the easy and light yoke only the prize at the end of the journey? It just feels so often like the spiritual disciplines are another form of religious performance, and the rest Jesus promises remains a distant hope. [18:08] I have been thinking of freedom - Galatians 5:1. I notice when I talk with other Christians that there is fear and resistance when it comes to freedom. Why is that if this is something Christ wants us to truly experience? What does true freedom look like in ordinary everyday life? Are there practices that help position us to experience true freedom more as Christ desires for us? [31:18] How can we work toward a faith-filled marriage? What can spiritual formation look like in the context of marriage? How do each of you share spiritual life with your spouses? Resources Evelyn Underhill’s Prayer Book , by Robyn Wrigley-Carr Sacrament of the Present Moment , by Jean-Pierre de Caussade